How do you deal with Chinese women?
- Joined: Sep 8th, 2008
- Posts: 91
OK, I don't really expect this to be very helpful, but I'm willing to try just about anything. So here's my situation:
I'm an American, met a Beijing girl in America (already had her green card before we met), got married in the US, built a business together and have a beautiful little girl. We've been together almost 10 years now. Problem is, she's absolutely crazy. Before we married, my Taiwanese buddy said "Man, you'd better watch out for those mainland girls...they're all dragon ladies." He was right. She's got the most vicious temper and the cruelest mean streak I've ever seen. As an example, my 3-yr old daughter recently told her "I'm American, not Chinese" and said that her grandma (my mom) told her that...so now she won't let my mom see her granddaughter anymore, based on the "word" of a 3-yr old who didn't really understand what she was saying. She's suspicious to the point of raging paranoia. She's lied to me about several things, including about her son (whom she abandoned when he was 7 to come to the US, and whom I just brought over to the US). On one of my trips to Hong Kong, I caught a TV show talking about the Chinese culture of "wife-fearing" where the husband is "supposed" to be browbeaten and put down by his wife...then slink off and comfort himself with a mistress or a bottle, or both. So, my question is, is this a cultural thing, or is she just a complete bitch? Either way, I would've dumped her ass a long time ago if it weren't for my little girl. I can't abandon her, especially when her mother is so emotionally unstable. I guess it doesn't really matter much whether it's cultural or personal, cuz either way it sux. I was just wondering if maybe somebody else on here has had similar problems in trying to have a serious, mature relationship with a Chinese woman.
And if you don't have anything helpful to say, then just don't say anything at all. This is my daughter's life, and that's not a laughing matter.
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babylion
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
she needs you to "spoil" her.
she sounded self-abashed to me for the nationality identity issue. For some parts, have you been sensitive enough about this kind of incidents during your talks or opinions over inter-racial arguments?
it sounds like she didnt solve problems immediately but accumulated them to a certain stage and explode eventually. And once she does that, she always does that.
marriage is a two-way traffic, i suggest you guys go professional helps rather than listen to Taiwainese counterpart.
She is your wife, and you are the husband.
Skipinbj
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
Tell me more stories. Makes me feel better about my own marriage. Good therapy.....
I love China! 一切反动派都是纸北京猫!!!
oscarmeyer
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
You do need professional help. Hopefully from someone who also knows about the modern China culture. It's not just cultural because you guys have been together for 10 yrs . You also have to stop being a nice guy . There is a column about why young Chinese girls like old western guys ? Besides money, love, security ,& all of those BS's ....... is " CONTROL " ! Yes, they can control the old b*st*rds , while they won't be able to do it with old rich Chinese guys ....
bigorange
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
son is everything of mother in China,maybe she is lonely in USA,if the son is American, she have nothing from her ancestor in USA。she is lonely
Hi,I`m big orange.
beijingcat
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
no one can help u for this case except u urself need to learn not generalize a conclusion from one individual case. There are tons of happy cross-cultural couples out there so better check out yourself to see the way you communicate with your wife. Don't try to simply use the 'cultural conflicts' to cover the fact that both of you don't understand how to manage your relationship well. I heard that many cross-cultural couples imputed their failure to 'cultural thing' but not their personalities. thats totally b.s., and too lazy, selfish and irresponsible.
“Dogs have Owners, Cats have Staff.”
Caffeine
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
My wife can be overwhelmingly stubborn and has said some pretty cruel things pertaining to our cultural differences. But NOTHING like what you've described! I agree with previous posts on seeking professional help. She obviously has a lot of extra baggage. For your daughter's sake, try not to let it all get to you. You need to take the high road and just let things roll off your back as much as you can. Be firm but not confrontational.
apple2008
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
" I would've dumped her ass a long time ago if it weren't for my little girl. I can't abandon her, especially when her mother is so emotionally unstable"
Well according to your words i think you already not love your wife any more thats why only "complain"left ...there is no culture things business or mailand chinese woman problem..its just your attitude for your relationship .if you ever really calm to talk with your wife like: our daught is america and my mom said nothing wrong ,also she is half chinese blabla... and i couldnt help wondering if just a sentence for that your wife stopped your Mom to see her granddaughter?? your wife and your mom must have some conflicts for long time...so i guess here you have big responsibility for your failed relationship like this ..because the taiwanese's word never left your mind so you just gave her a name and never wanna comunicate with her ..and who said divoce or break up is Abandon for your daughter ,did you ever think 'run away"? thats a horrible attitude too. because even you guys divoced you have to have a good relationship with each other,for you ,for her and for your daughter... let the kid live between you and her fight and unhappiness is a much more horrible thing !!! no one can be perfect so be positive ,try to find way to solve the problem of you two .. i guess you need to have a long talk with her as a friend and husband ... no offence,just some of my opion...
Mockingbird
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
She needs to get laid... ...if that doesn't help, just dump her.... she is a hopeless bitter miserable thing....
No words are racist. Actions are racist.
Say what you need to explain yourself.
If you are not racist it will shine through.
V
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
1. Grow a pair.
If my wife ever said something like that to me, I'd simply say "Um...nope." Unless your mum is a child molester, I think that's a pretty unreasonable request for a wife to make. If you want your kid to see your mum, then you have the right to do that.
2. Cultural differences
I don't see this as a cultural problem at all. Political gamesmanship in marriages is universal. Your child is being used as a chess piece to gain some other advantage. Find out what that other thing is. Once you know why she's lashing out at you (or your mum), you'll have an opportunity to either fix the underlying problem or just revert back to rule #1.
3. Cultural differences part deux
I have noticed the same sensitivity both in China and in the US to Chinese women with mixed-race children wanting them to maintain their "Chineseness." Nothing wrong with that, but you need to make it clear that the ax swings both ways. You should embrace both cultures. Cherry pick the good parts of each and (hopefully) throw out the garbage.
Good luck, man.
Cheers,
fencingguy
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
just build up evidence against her and divorce her so you can get the child. Talk to a chinese and american lawyer and ask them what you need to win custody. My mother divorced my father and married a great guy it was the best thing she ever did.
V
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
It seems like the guy is in the US now. News flash: Unless the mother is a street hooker with a heroin habit, it is extremely unlikely that the husband will get sole custody of the child. That just doesn't happen very often, especially for a younger child (which seems to be the case here).
Cheers,
blucat
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
I have been married about the same time to a mainland woman, and also have kids, so I hear you on that. I couldn't bear the thought of breaking up the family, even if things weren't great.
I know that this will sound glib, but talk to her. There must be a reason that you fell in love with her, and try to find it again.
Go away for a weekend, find time to be together and communicate about it. That can be hard with Chinese, because they don't like to talk about there emotions (which is why they are so over-the-top emotional on here, letting out all the pent up feelings behind an anonymous wall)
But anyway, that would be my advice. And like someone else said, it wouldn't hurt to spoil her a bit-make sure she feels secure in your love and respect for her-then start grinding away at the communication stone.
slapdaddym
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
V's correct. I'm an American lawyer, and getting sole custody, particularly in my state, just isn't realistic. The reason that divorce would amount to abandonment of my daughter is that my wife would simply take her to China and I'd never see them again...she's threatened to do that already. I've done some research into child abduction, and if she ever got my daughter to China, it'd be almost impossible for me to get her back.
As to what some of the other people said, I've never claimed to be blameless in this. I've been way too nice to her and let this go too far. I never imagined that just being nice to my wife would make her think I'm weak and she could control me. I'm not by nature a mean and angry person...but I can tell that being with her for this long is changing me for the worse. Ultimately, I believe she hates herself and thinks that anyone who loves her must be inferior and therefore worthy only of her disdain. She is abusive to most of her family as well...and then later she'll be overly generous. That's a classic pattern among abusers, isn't it?
I'm also not blaming this all on "cultural differences" by any means. I understand that most of this comes from the way our personalities interact. But I was hoping that maybe some cultural insight would give me some leverage that I could use to improve the situation...such as, somebody on here mentioned that you have to invite Chinese people to a party three times before they think you're serious. Maybe there just aren't any cultural insights that can help here.
As for the relationship between her and my mother, there have been some misunderstandings and annoyances, but nothing that I would think would rise to the level of a complete split like this. The way my wife works is that she becomes irrationally (sometimes even violently) angry about something, then eventually, after not talking about it for a long time, she'll soften her attitude progressively. Problem is, this is taking a very, very long time. My mom hasn't seen her granddaughter in almost 6 months. I've arranged little "trysts" where they can see each other, but that's not going to work for long. And, believe me, I've used every rational argument in the book for why this is stupid and just plain wrong. But reason and logic just don't work with her.
Danmairen
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
It is virtually impossible to hand out good advice when you only hear one side of the story. We all know that,, how many times haven't we told our sobstories to friends and family or heard a similar one from them. It is never impartial and giving advice solely on that basis might just add fuel to the fire. Someone mentioned counseling,, get it. To me it sounds like a classic Love-gone-but-we-have-a-child-to-consider case and they are hard to solve without anyone getting seriously hurt. The only reasonable piece of advice I can offer is not staying together just because of the child if you have tried hard for years to make it work and you feel like being in hell. If you and the missus are unhappy it will rub off on the child no matter if you split up or stay together. The only thing that really can cause lasting damage to a child is when the parents fail to put their offspring first after a divorce and you use the kids to get back at your former spouse.
(Brian starts singing)
Stewie : Hey, who sings that song?
Brian: James Taylor.
Stewie: Let's keep it that way.
Danmairen
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
Don't know about it being a pattern for abusers but it might be a sign of being passive-aggressive which again is a sign of possible mental illness and/or psychotic behaviour.
(Brian starts singing)
Stewie : Hey, who sings that song?
Brian: James Taylor.
Stewie: Let's keep it that way.
slapdaddym
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
I agree completely. You do need both sides of the story to really give good advice, b/c then you'd see how I let my frustration and anger over being treated unfairly build up and spill out in unhelpful ways and all the other mistakes I'm making. We do need counseling, but she refuses to do it, saying that she doesn't have any problem or that counseling is just BS anyway and won't solve anything. Any ideas on how I can persuade her that it would help?
V
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
That's a pretty tough row to hoe there m8. I'm not a lawyer (but you are). If you think there is even the remote chance that she'll flee the country with the baby, you need to get the baby's passport and then see what your legal options are for a court to prohibit taking the child out of the country without your permission. That probably won't stop someone who is determined, but at least you'll have some legal paperwork in your court if/when you need to pursue her in China (which I agree would be a nightmare).
If someone threatened to slink out of the country with my child I'd probably already be in divorce court. That's just really f'd up and I'd never be able to trust that person again. From your other post, this doesn't seem like a cultural divide, but a larger relationship issue.
Good luck.
beijingcat
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
from all OP's posts especially the first one the OP sounds quite tough, uptight, impatient and even judgmental and OP's wife doesnt sound weak or tolerant at all. ummm two hard nuts are together...its obviously all about personality and nothing to do with cultural differences. according to both of ur personalities there is no other way than keeping communicating and making compromises.
“Dogs have Owners, Cats have Staff.”
YunRui
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
It's interesting that from the few words , slapdaddym wrote responders have judged and described him as "nice guy," "no balls," "tough, uptight, judgemental." That's all quite a range of character/personality descriptors. The OP's wife has been judged and described as "self-abashed," "a hopeless, bitter thing," "not weak, intolerant," "psychotic." That's quite a range too.
First,I agree with Damairen - there's ALWAYS two sides to the story. Second, the OP wasn't asking people to figure out what's wrong with his wife or both of them ("I was just wondering if maybe somebody else on here has had similar problems in trying to have a serious, mature relationship with a Chinese woman." - OP slapdaddym). Third, there's some really good advice directed to both the OP and his wife.
Stay Hungry!
Pain is a requirement, not a curse
Skipinbj
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
Errr not quite the way I saw it. It seems like his wife is a nutjob, and he can't stand up for himself.
@OP: Honestly, stand up for yourself. What do you mean she won't let your daughter see your mum? As V said, unless she a kiddy fiddler or something that's an unreasonable request. Your kid should grow up surrounded by her family; you owe it to your child. You don't need someone's elses approval for something like this. Sort it out now, be a man, otherwise you and more importantly your daughter are gonna have a terrible life.
I love China! 一切反动派都是纸北京猫!!!
Skipinbj
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
Errr not quite the way I saw it. It seems like his wife is a nutjob, and he can't stand up for himself.
@OP: Honestly, stand up for yourself. What do you mean she won't let your daughter see your mum? As V said, unless she a kiddy fiddler or something that's an unreasonable request. Your kid should grow up surrounded by her family; you owe it to your child. You don't need someone's elses approval for something like this. Sort it out now, be a man, otherwise you and more importantly your daughter are gonna have a terrible life.
I love China! 一切反动派都是纸北京猫!!!
Anon
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
Let's see. She abandoned her 7 year old son and now is threatening to take your daughter to China without your permission. Unless you can handle this through therapy. It looks to me like you should start building up a case for a divorce.
LaoSichuan
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
one aspect of the conflict:
she did everything to go to USA, even abandoned her son, and now after many years she discovers that the USA is not the paradise she has expected.
This is a situation rather typical for immigrants.
What do you think of moving to China with your whole family?
A new start from scratch in a new environment, forget all the trouble you had before.
Ask her what is her opinion.
slapdaddym
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
Yeah, the range of responses is kind of surprising. It's difficult to convey the full complexity of my situation in this format, and I am always hesitant to offer advice on personal matters to my friends because you never know what goes on behind closed doors. As I said originally, I don't expect to find THE ANSWER here, just maybe a little insight that might jar my thinking a little and help me get onto the right track with her. There has been some good advice, and I really do appreciate the time and attention everyone has given to my problem...even from those who say I'm a wuss. I'm OK with that, because nobody really has the full picture anyway. And nothing anyone can call me matters compared to my daughter's happiness. I'll be a wuss for her all day, if that's what I have to do to give her a good life. Ultimately, though, I don't think she'd be very well-served by a father who is completely subservient to her mother. On the other hand, as any man who's ever been in a mature relationship with a strong-minded woman knows, you have to pick your battles carefully. The balancing act just gets a lot harder when you're dealing with someone who can be as completely irrational and cruel as my wife is being towards my mother. That's really the love-killer here...cuz how can I ever trust her again? How do I know she won't hear some BS rumor about me cheating on her and decide to believe it and go nuclear on me? If she's willing to believe, fervently and without question, the innocent ramblings of a 3-yr old ("I BELIEVE MY DAUGHTER!!"), then what other insanities might she not believe in the future, regardless of all evidence to the contrary? Her intensity about this has reached the point that its even making me question her intelligence, not to mention her sanity. She has been under enormous pressure lately, and that's really the only reason I've humored her this far. But those pressures should abate very soon, and if her attitude remains as intransigent as it is now, then I probably will have to file for divorce. I really hope it doesn't come to that, but our relationship certainly cannot continue on like this. Change will have to happen, one way or the other.
slapdaddym
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
That's very perceptive of you. Yes, we have talked about moving to China, and have even made some plans in that direction. In some ways, I think that could be a very positive development. On the other hand, because she has threatened to steal my daughter, I don't feel that I can completely trust her. If we all move to China, I'd be almost completely dependent on her at least for awhile. I don't speak enough Chinese to "get by" on my own there. I can get a teaching job pretty easily, I think. But her family does have pretty good connections, so I would think that she could have me deported pretty easily too if she ever decided to get rid of me. I'm just not sure that I can take that big a risk of losing my daughter forever. She's my only child, and I love her more than I ever imagined I could love anybody or anything. If you don't have kids, you probably can't understand this. I know I sure as hell didn't understand how it really feels to be a father before she came along. So moving to China seems like a HUGE risk to me. But if she could somehow restore my trust in her, then, yes, I'd certainly be willing to move to China to keep our family together and make us all happy again. Then the question becomes, how can she restore that trust? And how can I make sure that I REALLY can and do trust her again and I'm not just making decisions based on wishful thinking? Those are the tough questions.
slapdaddym
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
I've told myself exactly the same thing many times before. And I know how to stand up for myself...when it's just myself I'm standing up for. But I've never dealt with a situation where the stakes are so high. I guess that's what's really causing me to put up with this. If this were an American woman and I didn't have to worry about her abducting my child, I'd never tolerate this crap. But I guess the idea of never seeing my daughter again has kinda spooked me. She is using our daughter as a weapon to control me, and it's working. I know I have to stop it now or she'll keep doing it for the rest of my life, and in order to really put a stop to it, I have to be willing to face the chance that I might lose my daughter. Not that I'd ever give her up...I'd keep fighting for her no matter what it took. But in order to take away the power my wife is using to control me, I need to be willing to lose my daughter while still loving her. It's a very hard thing to do. Now I know how generals feel...to be a good general, you must love the army. But to be a good general, you must also order the death of the thing you love. I think that's similar to the paradox I'm facing right now. Thanks for forcing me to really think hard about it...not that I haven't before, of course, but my thoughts seem to take different turns when I have to write them down.
LaoSichuan
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
Culture:
Each person is different, generalization is always problematic, but three points for thought:
1. Chinese women are *NOT* docile (contrary to some stereotypes). They are well-educated, self-confident and know what they want.
Some old-fashioned men may see them as "dragon ladies". I would see it as a chance to build a truly equal relationship.
2. Compared with their European and American counterparts, emotions of Chinese women 30years+ are deeper (well, that's my private observation. The very young generation seems to be more shallow). If they fall in love with a man, they do it 200%, and subsequently they are hurt very much, if the relationsship does not work well.
3. Chinese woman are full of wisdom.
Have you ever recognized what a treasure you have living right besides you?
Don't let your marriage be destroyed by trivialities. Take time on the weekends to talk about history, philosophy, the sense of life. You together may find out what is really important and that it is not worth to quarrel about minor issues.
You may have to learn Chinese because many aspects of Chinese culture can not be translated into Englisch.
Women in general:
the character of women may change after birth of a baby, because of sudden changes of hormon levels (similar like the character of a man may change after a surgery). Don't blame her for that, that's nature. It may take years to recover.
My conclusion:
treat her better, she was willing to spend 10 years together with you. Be grateful!
beijingcat
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
....i c
don't let her catch any real evidence though otherwise u will lose everything including ur daughter.
what does WUSS mean btw?
“Dogs have Owners, Cats have Staff.”
zhenlai
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
You need to get control of your daughter before the wife spirits her away to China and ruins the poor child's life forever.
美国鬼子
KZ
Re: How do you deal with Chinese women?
lol
No offense, but don't be ridiculous. The title should be "how I deal with my wife?".
I don't think your situation has much to do with her CHinese background, but her personality.
Marriage is hard(heard so tho), good luck.
Bottlenecking