One time, at lunch with a coworker, I left my chopsticks standing upright in a bowl of rice.
I was mortified.
That coworker has never talked to me since.
isnt that a japanese culture? death?
Chinese has this actually, but now the youth is not see this kind of traditional custom seriously. Japanese get their traditional custom generation by generation that I personal think we should also do the same as ours.
One time, at lunch with a coworker, I left my chopsticks standing upright in a bowl of rice.
I was mortified.
That coworker has never talked to me since.
isnt that a japanese culture? death?
Chinese has this actually, but now the youth is not see this kind of traditional custom seriously. Japanese get their traditional custom generation by generation that I personal think we should also do the same as ours.
1. Thinking that they understand "China" and "Chinese"
2. Convince themselves that the Chinese think they are superior to foreigners, and deny that in fact it is them themselves that feel that way about Chinese.
3. Believing that the taxi driver is deliberately not understanding their instructions on where they want to go.
1. Thinking that they understand "China" and "Chinese"
2. Convince themselves that the Chinese think they are superior to foreigners, and deny that in fact it is them themselves that feel that way about Chinese.
3. Believing that the taxi driver is deliberately not understanding their instructions on where they want to go.
1. Thinking that they understand "China" and "Chinese"
2. Convince themselves that the Chinese think they are superior to foreigners, and deny that in fact it is them themselves that feel that way about Chinese.
3. Believing that the taxi driver is deliberately not understanding their instructions on where they want to go.
good one.
Dear god, make me a bird, so I can fly far, far far away from here.
Blucat..are you serious?
Chinese have a total superiority complex when it comes to foreigners, I can't remember the amount of times I've heard, 'You don't understand China, you're a foreigner' or 'China has a long history' together with a patronising smile.
You think just because you have a long history means you are special?
History is history.
Look at China now, you don't have a proper sewage system in you capital for f*cks sake.
You talk about 'soft power' and development, but it's gonna take a long time to develop a country the size of China with the amount of people in China to the level of the West.
Even the buildings you are building now are of bad quality. Financial street paving stones started breaking and coming up after one year ( I lived there) the same goes for all your prestige projects, all show and no substance.
Chinese think that they are somehow different from other societies, that foreign 'barbarians' are unable to understand the complexities of Chinese society. hahah what a f*cking joke. That kind of arrogance led to the fall of China in the first place.
Chinese are human beings just the same as the rest of the world. The fact that Chinese society lasted so long is mainly down to luck.
Chinese have a total superiority complex when it comes to foreigners, I can't remember the amount of times I've heard, 'You don't understand China, you're a foreigner' or 'China has a long history' together with a patronising smile.
You think just because you have a long history means you are special?
Sounds exactly like Japan and Japanese people. I've had almost exactly the same thing said to me on many occasions.
They are actually only a little off the mark though. It's not impossible for foreigners to understand the country and the people, but it takes a long time, and the average foreigner thinks they understand it a lot better than they generally do. But even with understanding, it's only understanding from an outsider's view, not from being one of the people growing up as part of the culture. But, that being said, the same is true of all cultures - outsiders can never really know what it's like to grow up and be a part of that culture, they can only at best get a very complete outsider's view of it.
Blucat..are you serious?
Chinese have a total superiority complex when it comes to foreigners, I can't remember the amount of times I've heard, 'You don't understand China, you're a foreigner' or 'China has a long history' together with a patronising smile.
You think just because you have a long history means you are special?
History is history.
Look at China now, you don't have a proper sewage system in you capital for f*cks sake.
You talk about 'soft power' and development, but it's gonna take a long time to develop a country the size of China with the amount of people in China to the level of the West.
Even the buildings you are building now are of bad quality......
Chinese think that they are somehow different from other societies, that foreign 'barbarians' are unable to understand the complexities of Chinese society. hahah what a f*cking joke. That kind of arrogance led to the fall of China in the first place.
......
I'm not sure if Blucat was serious when he's saying that, but what you said above just perfectly proved his first and second points are right:
1. Thinking that they understand "China" and "Chinese".
2. Convince themselves that the Chinese think they are superior to foreigners, and deny that in fact it is them themselves that feel that way about Chinese.
And,
What's wrong with a country's being special because of its long history? To me, every society is unique, and special includes good and bad sides. Do you think history means nothing to a coutry? I'm afraid I can't agree with you on that if so.
History is NOT ONLY history, it DOES have influrence on the present, more or less. I'm not saying everything that's happening currently could be 100% explained by history. Using history as an excuse is probably what a loser would do but, separating a country's history and its present doesn't sound so fair, either.
Paul wrote:
The fact that Chinese society lasted so long is mainly down to luck.
What an effin' joke, you made my day!
Dear god, make me a bird, so I can fly far, far far away from here.
@ HuanChu, I guess many laowais never think they make mistakes in China, whatever appears to be nonsense is mainly because too many Chinese people are uneducated, uncivilized, brainwashed and narrow minded.
Dear god, make me a bird, so I can fly far, far far away from here.
But, that being said, the same is true of all cultures - outsiders can never really know what it's like to grow up and be a part of that culture, they can only at best get a very complete outsider's view of it.
fair enough, thx.
Dear god, make me a bird, so I can fly far, far far away from here.
basically I think a good chunk of the members of most societies feel themselves superior to outsiders. If Einstein, JFK and Ernest Hemingway traipsed together into the Amazon rainforest and into a tribe of indigenous forest-dwellers that wore no clothes and didn't know how to read and write, I'm sure most of them would look at that trio and say to themselves, "these people don't really know much about getting along in this world, do they?"
Laowai that are so quick to use the phrase "all chinese people are ..." should really try turning that concept around and realize they are making the same generalizations that drive them crazy when they hear "all foreigners are ..."
So with that in mind, my #1 top mistake laowais make in china is:
1. Using limited observations and experiences to classify all Chinese. Failing to understand that not every experience you have is a symptom of the fundamental characteristics of the Chinese people.
They are actually only a little off the mark though. It's not impossible for foreigners to understand the country and the people, but it takes a long time, and the average foreigner thinks they understand it a lot better than they generally do. But even with understanding, it's only understanding from an outsider's view, not from being one of the people growing up as part of the culture. But, that being said, the same is true of all cultures - outsiders can never really know what it's like to grow up and be a part of that culture, they can only at best get a very complete outsider's view of it.
Your post helps justify my stance that people born in the United States who look Chinese are, in fact, not Chinese at all. They know little or nothing about the culture and are truly outsiders to the natives here.
Your post helps justify my stance that people born in the United States who look Chinese are, in fact, not Chinese at all. They know little or nothing about the culture and are truly outsiders to the natives here.
How do you know that they know nothing or little about their culture?
I am sure there are many that know plenty, given that family is where we learn most.
They are actually only a little off the mark though. It's not impossible for foreigners to understand the country and the people, but it takes a long time, and the average foreigner thinks they understand it a lot better than they generally do. But even with understanding, it's only understanding from an outsider's view, not from being one of the people growing up as part of the culture. But, that being said, the same is true of all cultures - outsiders can never really know what it's like to grow up and be a part of that culture, they can only at best get a very complete outsider's view of it.
Your post helps justify my stance that people born in the United States who look Chinese are, in fact, not Chinese at all. They know little or nothing about the culture and are truly outsiders to the natives here.
There are two concepts to the word 'Chinese' one being racially Chinese (which isn't exactly complete, seeing as there are in fact many different racial groups who make up the Chinese), and culturally Chinese.
Someone who is born racially Chinese to Chinese parents will not be 100% culturally Chinese. They can't be, as they are not growing up directly in Chinese society, going to Chinese schools, and being surrounded by Chinese people and culture every day. But, if they grow up with parents who raise them in the Chinese manner, surrounded by other people from the homeland, possibly speaking Chinese and maybe even going to Chinese schools, and visiting the homeland every so often, then it cannot be said that they are "not Chinese at all" or that "they know little or nothing about the culture", as they will have a fairly solid grasp of it. Of course it won't be the same as actually growing up with 100% cultural immersion, but neither will they be as much an outsider as your common FOB laowai who has only read a little of this or that in books, and maybe studied a little Chinese before going to the country.
The most common mistake newcomers make is to think chinese are all the same, "we" or collective mass. Actually when speaking in chinese, "we" isn't used more often than it does in English. Most of the times "I" is used unless refer to a group of people then "we" is used. The same as English.
With that I see many laowais on this forum have jumped over that hoop start recognize the individualism in chinese, and different entities in China.
Actually laowais, give yourself a round of applause! laowais in China are much more worldly and knowledgeable of China than the avareage Joe in your home country.
The most common mistake newcomers make is to think chinese are all the same, "we" or collective mass. Actually when speaking in chinese, "we" isn't used more often than it does in English. Most of the times "I" is used unless refer to a group of people then "we" is used. The same as English.
With that I see many laowais(racist remark) on this forum have jumped over that hoop start recognize the individualism in chinese, and different entities in China.
Actually laowais(racist remark), give yourself a round of applause! laowais(racist remark) in China are much more worldly and knowledgeable of China than the avareage Joe in your home country.
Stop being so racist and using the word laowai. I don't call you any racist names so don't call me a racist name.
There are two concepts to the word 'Chinese' one being racially Chinese (which isn't exactly complete, seeing as there are in fact many different racial groups who make up the Chinese), and culturally Chinese.
Someone who is born racially Chinese to Chinese parents will not be 100% culturally Chinese. They can't be, as they are not growing up directly in Chinese society, going to Chinese schools, and being surrounded by Chinese people and culture every day. But, if they grow up with parents who raise them in the Chinese manner, surrounded by other people from the homeland, possibly speaking Chinese and maybe even going to Chinese schools, and visiting the homeland every so often, then it cannot be said that they are "not Chinese at all" or that "they know little or nothing about the culture", as they will have a fairly solid grasp of it. Of course it won't be the same as actually growing up with 100% cultural immersion, but neither will they be as much an outsider as your common FOB laowai who has only read a little of this or that in books, and maybe studied a little Chinese before going to the country.
Perhaps its the same as talking about a room full of Indians, Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese and Singaporeans, and calling them 'Asian', without talking to any of them directly.
I.e. "The Asians over there want to know where the hotel is." Some of them may find it offensive.
Also, it's the fact that many Chinese use it to refer to us, even when they know which country we are from.
Also, in my experience, when i refer to a Chinese in a foreign airport (LA and London come to mind specifically) and they hear me, they seem none to happy.
Why would that be?
A very smart man wrote:
Remember, the courage to be wrong is paramount in importance to the ability to be right.
wefrucar
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
One time, at lunch with a coworker, I left my chopsticks standing upright in a bowl of rice.
I was mortified.
That coworker has never talked to me since.
Sometimes I feel it is maybe unbearable always be traditional Chinese girl.
Monkey King
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
2. That yes means yes
"China is a big country, inhabited by many Chinese."
--Charles de Gaulle
bobby_liu
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
isnt that a japanese culture? death?
Jamie Shorter 39
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
1.Get angry with Chinese people (if you aint got the money of guanxi it will achieve nothing and they will see you as an even lower piece of dirt).
2. Let their fake celebrity status go to their heads (see above).
3. Eat too often at MacDonalds.
4. Don't study Chinese.
Actually the list could go to about twenty but these are some of the best ones.
jiaruchan
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
One of the top mistakes they make is always saying thank-you to restaurant waitresses. Chinese don't do that. Do as the Romans do, please.
Jade
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
Chinese has this actually, but now the youth is not see this kind of traditional custom seriously. Japanese get their traditional custom generation by generation that I personal think we should also do the same as ours.
bobby_liu
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
so you are a traditional gal?
blucat
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
1. Thinking that they understand "China" and "Chinese"
2. Convince themselves that the Chinese think they are superior to foreigners, and deny that in fact it is them themselves that feel that way about Chinese.
3. Believing that the taxi driver is deliberately not understanding their instructions on where they want to go.
bobby_liu
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
your answer is so serious.
thanks.
YYZ
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
good one.
Dear god, make me a bird, so I can fly far, far far away from here.
Paul
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
Blucat..are you serious?
Chinese have a total superiority complex when it comes to foreigners, I can't remember the amount of times I've heard, 'You don't understand China, you're a foreigner' or 'China has a long history' together with a patronising smile.
You think just because you have a long history means you are special?
History is history.
Look at China now, you don't have a proper sewage system in you capital for f*cks sake.
You talk about 'soft power' and development, but it's gonna take a long time to develop a country the size of China with the amount of people in China to the level of the West.
Even the buildings you are building now are of bad quality. Financial street paving stones started breaking and coming up after one year ( I lived there) the same goes for all your prestige projects, all show and no substance.
Chinese think that they are somehow different from other societies, that foreign 'barbarians' are unable to understand the complexities of Chinese society. hahah what a f*cking joke. That kind of arrogance led to the fall of China in the first place.
Chinese are human beings just the same as the rest of the world. The fact that Chinese society lasted so long is mainly down to luck.
HuanChu
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
Paul, fair comments, I'm not sure i agree with all of them, but fair enough.
But in response to OP's question, what do you think are mistakes made by foreigners here?
A very smart man wrote:
白人
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
Sounds exactly like Japan and Japanese people. I've had almost exactly the same thing said to me on many occasions.
They are actually only a little off the mark though. It's not impossible for foreigners to understand the country and the people, but it takes a long time, and the average foreigner thinks they understand it a lot better than they generally do. But even with understanding, it's only understanding from an outsider's view, not from being one of the people growing up as part of the culture. But, that being said, the same is true of all cultures - outsiders can never really know what it's like to grow up and be a part of that culture, they can only at best get a very complete outsider's view of it.
YYZ
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
I'm not sure if Blucat was serious when he's saying that, but what you said above just perfectly proved his first and second points are right:
1. Thinking that they understand "China" and "Chinese".
2. Convince themselves that the Chinese think they are superior to foreigners, and deny that in fact it is them themselves that feel that way about Chinese.
And,
What's wrong with a country's being special because of its long history? To me, every society is unique, and special includes good and bad sides. Do you think history means nothing to a coutry? I'm afraid I can't agree with you on that if so.
History is NOT ONLY history, it DOES have influrence on the present, more or less. I'm not saying everything that's happening currently could be 100% explained by history. Using history as an excuse is probably what a loser would do but, separating a country's history and its present doesn't sound so fair, either.
What an effin' joke, you made my day!
Dear god, make me a bird, so I can fly far, far far away from here.
YYZ
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
@ HuanChu, I guess many laowais never think they make mistakes in China, whatever appears to be nonsense is mainly because too many Chinese people are uneducated, uncivilized, brainwashed and narrow minded.
Dear god, make me a bird, so I can fly far, far far away from here.
YYZ
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
fair enough, thx.
Dear god, make me a bird, so I can fly far, far far away from here.
YunRui
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
2. Believing everything that other laowais say about the Chinese.
3. Believing everything that other laowais say about their China experiences.
Stay Hungry!
Pain is a requirement, not a curse
Sciency
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
1. Believing what they've been told.
2. Engaging in disharmonious long-term/critical/creative thinking.
3. Pointing out the obvious.
Galaxies don't move Sciency. They're in a fixed position.
admin
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
basically I think a good chunk of the members of most societies feel themselves superior to outsiders. If Einstein, JFK and Ernest Hemingway traipsed together into the Amazon rainforest and into a tribe of indigenous forest-dwellers that wore no clothes and didn't know how to read and write, I'm sure most of them would look at that trio and say to themselves, "these people don't really know much about getting along in this world, do they?"
Laowai that are so quick to use the phrase "all chinese people are ..." should really try turning that concept around and realize they are making the same generalizations that drive them crazy when they hear "all foreigners are ..."
So with that in mind, my #1 top mistake laowais make in china is:
1. Using limited observations and experiences to classify all Chinese. Failing to understand that not every experience you have is a symptom of the fundamental characteristics of the Chinese people.
Follow thebeijinger on weibo! http://weibo.com/tbjmagazine
bobby_liu
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
zhenlai
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
Your post helps justify my stance that people born in the United States who look Chinese are, in fact, not Chinese at all. They know little or nothing about the culture and are truly outsiders to the natives here.
美国鬼子
mijc
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
believe everything western media and govenments say about china and chinese people.
blucat
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
How do you know that they know nothing or little about their culture?
I am sure there are many that know plenty, given that family is where we learn most.
白人
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
There are two concepts to the word 'Chinese' one being racially Chinese (which isn't exactly complete, seeing as there are in fact many different racial groups who make up the Chinese), and culturally Chinese.
Someone who is born racially Chinese to Chinese parents will not be 100% culturally Chinese. They can't be, as they are not growing up directly in Chinese society, going to Chinese schools, and being surrounded by Chinese people and culture every day. But, if they grow up with parents who raise them in the Chinese manner, surrounded by other people from the homeland, possibly speaking Chinese and maybe even going to Chinese schools, and visiting the homeland every so often, then it cannot be said that they are "not Chinese at all" or that "they know little or nothing about the culture", as they will have a fairly solid grasp of it. Of course it won't be the same as actually growing up with 100% cultural immersion, but neither will they be as much an outsider as your common FOB laowai who has only read a little of this or that in books, and maybe studied a little Chinese before going to the country.
cathy2thousand
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
The most common mistake newcomers make is to think chinese are all the same, "we" or collective mass. Actually when speaking in chinese, "we" isn't used more often than it does in English. Most of the times "I" is used unless refer to a group of people then "we" is used. The same as English.
With that I see many laowais on this forum have jumped over that hoop start recognize the individualism in chinese, and different entities in China.
Actually laowais, give yourself a round of applause! laowais in China are much more worldly and knowledgeable of China than the avareage Joe in your home country.
zhenlai
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
Stop being so racist and using the word laowai. I don't call you any racist names so don't call me a racist name.
美国鬼子
zhenlai
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
CHINESE IS NOT A RACE! IT IS A NATIONALITY!
美国鬼子
blucat
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
Is that the entire counter argument you can muster there old boy?
He already says that Chinese is not a race in his first sentence.
Mistake number 4: Take the use of the word "laowai" as an insult.
ps-how can the term "laowai" be racist? There is no "laowai" race is their Zhenlai?
HuanChu
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
Perhaps its the same as talking about a room full of Indians, Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese and Singaporeans, and calling them 'Asian', without talking to any of them directly.
I.e. "The Asians over there want to know where the hotel is." Some of them may find it offensive.
Also, it's the fact that many Chinese use it to refer to us, even when they know which country we are from.
Also, in my experience, when i refer to a Chinese in a foreign airport (LA and London come to mind specifically) and they hear me, they seem none to happy.
Why would that be?
A very smart man wrote:
zhenlai
Re: Top 3 mistakes laowai make in china
I just felt like being a trouble maker. You can refer to me as the spiritual revolutionary if you wish.
美国鬼子